The Global Search for Education
“While the government would continue to be the largest driver of education, there is a need for philanthropists to complement the role of the government.” — Shiv Nadar
A Free Education
By C. M. Rubin with Harry Rubin and Michael Freeborn
Just imagine being able to offer very poor Indian children a chance in life: the gift of a world class education in boarding schools designed by the finest architects, spread over rambling acreage, complete with state of the art academic and housing facilities, not to mention an extensive sports complex with its own skating rink and cricket field.
Billionaire Shiv Nadar, Founder and Chairman — HCL and the Shiv Nadar Foundation, gets to do that. The VidyaGyan schools (there are currently two: VidyaGyan Bulandshar and VidyaGyan Sitapur) are his brainchild. VidyaGyan comprises 2 words: Vidya and Gyan. Vidya is a Sanskrit name for knowledge. It also is an epithet of the Hindu Goddess of Learning, Saraswati. The name of the school was inspired by the names of Kiran Nadar’s (wife of Shiv Nadar) maternal grandparents: Vidyavati, her grandmother, and Gyanchand, her grandfather. The VidyaGyan Schools are a social experiment in nurturing leadership from among highly gifted poor rural children in Uttar Pradesh, the most populous state in India. There are three major eligibility criteria for VidyaGyan Schools. First, the candidate should come from a rural area and must be studying in a government school. Second, the candidate should be a meritorious student (topper of class 5 board exam). Finally, the annual household income of the candidate’s family should be less than $1850 a year.
I asked Mr. Nadar to share with me his perspectives and thoughts on this inspiring education based philanthropic venture.
What is your vision for education in India and how do you believe your endeavors at schools like VidyaGyan will impact the key issues?
Today, 70 percent of India is rural and offers limited contribution to the growth and development of the nation. I believe that education is the single largest tool for large-scale high impact socio-economic transformation. Education empowers individuals and is vital to reap our demographic dividend. Education has the power to tap into rural talent and create leaders from diverse socio-economic backgrounds.
Our VidyaGyan Schools are set up in Uttar Pradesh (UP), India’s largest, but educationally one of its most backward, states. Of the population of 200 million, 77 percent of UP is rural. 70 percent of grade 5 students cannot read grade 2 text. VidyaGyan is a radical experiment to nurture and create leaders from rural India. We handpick the most meritorious grade 5 toppers from primary Government schools in rural Uttar Pradesh. They are selected through a rigorous admission process. The model is to reach out to the top of the bottom of the pyramid, create leaders for tomorrow and bridge the urban-rural divide.
We believe private foundations such as ours, the Shiv Nadar Foundation, cannot solve the problem of education in a vast country such as India. That is a role only the government can fulfill. We can, however, through VidyaGyan, hope to solve the problem of leadership in India.
“The objective is that these students would be ambassadors of the school and make changes in the communities they come from.” — Shiv Nadar
What do you believe are the key steps your government must take if it hopes to substantially improve the quality of education in India?
The Government of India has done commendable work in forwarding the cause of education since independence. The Indian Institutes of Technology, India’s tallest monument in technology higher education, has been an outcome of the government’s vision to build centers of excellence in research and technology in India. In the last six decades, the IIT’s have given the world some of the finest academicians, scientists, researchers, technocrats and entrepreneurs.
Today, the Sarva Shiksha Abhiyan, the world’s largest mass education program by the Government of India, implemented in partnership with State Governments, covers the entire country and addresses the education needs of 192 million children.
While the government would continue to be the largest driver of education, there is a need for philanthropists to complement the role of the government. This is where private foundations can step in.
What are the 3 things of greatest value that students get out of their education at the VidyaGyan School?
- Leadership skills.
- Confidence to excel and compete with the best in the world.
- Value to give back to society and create spirals of inspiration for the larger community.
Does your definition of educational excellence include an arts education for the students?
Education should encompass all the subjects and ensure all around development. Our curriculum is integrated into the Indian education system — the Central Board of Secondary Education (CBSE). The structure is tailored keeping in mind the background of children to achieve their goals and the CBSE curricula. VidyaGyan provides the necessary intensive remedial inputs through the initial two years, including resolution of language barriers and developing all the soft skills that go into the making of leaders. In addition to the CBSE curriculum, we believe the arts and sports are essential to shape leadership.
“The homogeneity helps bring in a level of comfort among the underprivileged children and helps them settle down in a reformed environment.” — Shiv Nadar
At $3200 per child per year, it would cost $3.2 million to educate 1000 students, $32 million to educate 10,000, and $320 million to educate 100,000 students. What is your ultimate objective for the number of students in your private system? Will you fund this entirely from your foundation’s assets or do you anticipate using other private or public sources of funds.
VidyaGyan currently has over 1000 students at our two schools in Bulandshahr and Sitapur in UP. The Foundation plans to build three VidyaGyan schools in Uttar Pradesh, which would finally have around 4200 students. The objective, however, is that these students would be ambassadors of the school and make changes in the communities they come from and drive a force multiplier impact of transformation. VidyaGyan, in the next 10 years, would directly impact thousands of lives. This in turn will have an impact on a few hundred thousand people, showing a clear long-term multiplier effect… and that is our goal. VidyaGyan can be a blueprint to millions of lives. We have created this institution on the pillars of Transformational Education and Creative Philanthropy to develop leaders from the lowest economic sections of the society. Creative Philanthropy is focused on building lasting institutions of excellence. Currently, VidyaGyan is a 100 percent philanthropic initiative of the Foundation.
Do you run the risk of the student body being too homogeneous, i.e., poor kids in an elite private school? Are you concerned by the lack of diversity?
VidyaGyan is a unique model that uproots underprivileged children from their existing environments and brings them to a completely different one they are not familiar with, both in terms of education and lifestyle. VidyaGyan aims to be a true enabler of transformation through education.
The homogeneity helps bring in a level of comfort among the underprivileged children and helps them settle down in a reformed environment. VidyaGyan is conceptualized as an elite private residential school on the lines of a Milton in the U.S. or a Doon in India, to ensure that we are able to drive inclusive leadership development for tomorrow. Homogeneity is a conscious choice to ensure effectiveness of the results we are trying to achieve. Please note, the schools are co-ed with a boy:girl ratio of almost 50:50. This is remarkable, given the lack of opportunities and state of girls’ education in India.
What do you anticipate/encourage your graduates to do after graduation? Will they be eligible for university scholarships in India or other parts of the world? Will they return to their villages or districts to find work?
We believe that VidyaGyan will be able to create complete accomplished individual leaders across all fields. Leadership is not of one’s own making. It is a product of the environment in which you grow up and the opportunities you get. We are offering the best education and exposure to the students to ensure complete transformation. We are certain that all our VidyaGyan students will be ready to compete effectively with their urban counterparts for scholarships and admissions to universities in India or outside.
My personal belief is that VidyaGyan will produce leaders across all fields — science, technology, sports, business, politics, government, academics, defense… and perhaps in time, even a Prime Minister of India. We also believe that the right balance of education, environment, values, ethics and opportunities would make these children go back to their communities. This is like creating concentric circles of impact to drive catalytic social transformation. And this is our vision for the future.
Shiv Nadar and C. M. Rubin
Photos courtesy of VidyaGyan Schools and Shiv Nadar Foundation
In The Global Search for Education, join me and globally renowned thought leaders including Sir Michael Barber (UK), Dr. Michael Block (US), Dr. Leon Botstein (US), Dr. Linda Darling-Hammond (US), Dr. Madhav Chavan (India), Professor Michael Fullan (Canada), Professor Howard Gardner (US), Professor Yvonne Hellman (The Netherlands), Professor Kristin Helstad (Norway), Jean Hendrickson (US), Professor Rose Hipkins (New Zealand), Professor Cornelia Hoogland (Canada), Mme. Chantal Kaufmann (Belgium), Professor Dominique Lafontaine (Belgium), Professor Hugh Lauder (UK), Professor Ben Levin (Canada), Professor Barry McGaw (Australia), Professor R. Natarajan (India), Dr. Denise Pope (US), Sridhar Rajagopalan (India), Dr. Diane Ravitch (US), Sir Ken Robinson (UK), Professor Pasi Sahlberg (Finland), Andreas Schleicher (PISA, OECD), Dr. Anthony Seldon (UK), Dr. David Shaffer (US), Dr. Kirsten Sivesind (Norway), Chancellor Stephen Spahn (US), Yves Theze (Lycee Francais US), Professor Charles Ungerleider (Canada), Professor Tony Wagner (US), Professor Dylan Wiliam (UK), Dr. Mark Wormald (UK), Professor Theo Wubbels (The Netherlands), Professor Michael Young (UK), and Professor Minxuan Zhang (China) as they explore the big picture education questions that all nations face today.
The Global Search for Education Community Page
C. M. Rubin is the author of two widely read online series for which she received a 2011 Upton Sinclair award, “The Global Search for Education” and “How Will We Read?” She is also the author of three bestselling books, including The Real Alice in Wonderland.
Follow C. M. Rubin on Twitter: www.twitter.com/@cmrubinworld
The Global Search for Education
“With our future as a nation at stake, we need to be bold for our schools to be successful with all children.” — Eric Nadelstern
A Look at New York Public Schools
By C. M. Rubin with Harry Rubin and Michael Freeborn
A Bronx native and graduate of DeWitt Clinton High School, Eric Nadelstern worked in New York City public schools for 39 years, rising to the position of Chief Schools Officer, Division of School Support in 2009, and to the position of Deputy Chancellor for the Division of School Support and Instruction for the New York City Department of Education in 2010, from which he retired last year. He is currently Professor of Practice in Education Leadership at Teachers College, Columbia University, from where he received a Master of Arts degree in 1973.
What are the problems we face in the New York City public school system?
We are spending $23 billion of the public’s hard earned money in New York City every year to support the country’s largest school district, and yet 35 percent of the students are not graduating from high school. The good news is just a few years ago it was half the students, and things had been frozen at that rate for the prior 50 years. Still, 35 percent are not graduating and the 35 percent who aren’t are largely male, African American and Latino. This is significant evidence that despite everything we are doing, we haven’t been able to close the achievement gap in the city.
What I think differentiates New York from some other countries in the world that I have visited or am familiar with is that we recognize there is an achievement gap. This contrasts with Israel which runs five separate and unequal school systems. Their primary concern, as in many other places, is to produce the few outstanding mathematicians and scientists who can compete with other countries, compared to thinking about educating the entire population to their highest potential.
In America, it is not that we aren’t producing enough college graduates. It’s that the students who are most likely to graduate are disproportionately white, Asian, and female in large urban areas versus male, African American, and Latino. You can still walk into a kindergarten class in New York City on the first day of school, and simply on the basis of race and how kids are dressed, predict with frightening accuracy which kids are likely to graduate 13 years later. To my mind, that is an intolerable situation and an indication of seated societal issues that we have not begun to address.
Why is the public school system to blame for this?
I’ll give you one example of how we exacerbate the problem, however unintentionally. For years in New York City we had a seniority transfer plan. The most senior and consequently most expensive teachers could transfer into middle class schools in areas where they were needed least. That created a situation in our poorest neighborhoods of the revolving door of the newest teachers. This went on decade after decade, seemingly with the approval of those in management positions.
“The astonishing thing is why there isn’t a greater sense of outrage from people who work in the system.” — Eric Nadelstern
What should be the goal of the public education system?
I am a product of public education. My parents were Holocaust refugees who came to this country a few years before I was born. I was the first member of my family to graduate from high school, let alone go to college. I understand how critical a public education is. To my mind, that is the American ideal.
So what things would you change and how would you make them better?
Initially, we were going in the right direction. We had a mayor who wasn’t beholden to the politicians or other interest groups. He didn’t seem to have personal ambitions beyond doing the best job he could. He was prepared to take courageous steps to address the issues. As time goes on, people invariably become seduced by the system. Joel Klein used to say I was groomed by the system to run the system but instead I chose to dismantle it, and that is what recommended me to him in the first place. My need was to change things in order to make them better.
In New York, you would have to tell people living in $4 million dollar coops on the Upper East Side that their kids would have as much chance of going to P.S. 199 as a kid in destitute circumstances in the Bronx; and that the school system was going to make sure that the kid in destitute circumstances had the same chance. Could you do that for very long? I don’t know, but that is what you need to do. When we were in a position to do it, we didn’t have the courage to do it.
I am of a mind that if schools fail to perform their function, it is more efficient and more effective to close them and give others an opportunity to do better. We closed dozens of large underperforming schools, primarily high schools, and replaced them with over 500 new small schools. Those new small schools, according to research, are graduating students from high school at a rate of eight percentage points more than the average school. That was moving in the right direction.
What can schools do about factors affecting kids outside of school?
Schools have little control once the kids leave them. Historically, we used that as an excuse for failure. The better schools create opportunities for parents to feel welcome in the school and even begin to address the needs of the students’ families. For example, they’ll offer immigration counseling or computer classes in the evening. Some schools partner with community organizations that are able to deal with the needs of the whole family. However, the truth is schools have limited capacity to have an impact on students’ families.
“I understand how critical a public education is. To my mind, that is the American ideal.”— Eric Nadelstern
Tell me more about schools that were going in the wrong direction and what went wrong.
I’ll give you some examples. We closed Stevenson High school. The school had 1800 student absences by Christmas, and no person in the building understood his responsibility. The attitude was it is the parent’s job to make sure the kid comes to school. In South Bronx High School, 20 percent of the kids made it to junior year. I met with the principal and his cabinet, and their attitude was shocking. They did not understand why I was so disturbed by that statistic because it had always been that way. If I wanted to see it any different, I would have to give them a better building; I would have to give them better supplies and materials; I would have to send them better teachers; I would have to pay them more; and I would have to send them better kids. If I sent them better kids, I would see how great they were.
At Morris High School there were 1700 kids enrolled. 1100 of them were freshmen. Year after year, the DOE sent them hundreds of 9th graders, and most of those kids never made it out of 9th grade. When I visited the school, one kid had written F… You in red letters across the back door of the building, and no one understood his responsibility to wipe that off as quickly as possible.
The astonishing thing is why there isn’t a greater sense of outrage from people who work in the system. The reality is we are becoming inured to failure. The people in the system are not necessarily the ones to blame for this. It is the structure we have given them. The rules and conditions under which they operate lead them to believe that nothing makes sense and nothing will ever change.
What would be the priority actions that you would take to improve the New York City public school system?
With our future as a nation at stake, we need to be bold for our schools to be successful with all children. What I would recommend is:
- Unzone all schools and give every child an equal opportunity by lottery to attend any school.
- Continue to close low performing large schools and replace them with campus communities of smaller, more successful ones.
- Decentralize authority to the school level and hold principals and teachers accountable for student performance.
- Encourage like-minded schools to network for purposes of mutual support and accountability.
- Significantly reduce central and field operations, and place the money saved directly into school budgets.
- Recruit and reward outstanding principals and teachers.
- Partner with not-for-profit organizations in the community to better serve students and their families.
- Support choice and competition represented by charter schools.
- Invite the private sector to compete in the world of K-12 education.
Eric Nadelstern and C. M. Rubin
Photos courtesy of NYC Department of Education and Eric Nadelstern
In The Global Search for Education, join me and globally renowned thought leaders including Sir Michael Barber (UK), Dr. Michael Block (US), Dr. Leon Botstein (US), Dr. Linda Darling-Hammond (US), Dr. Madhav Chavan (India), Professor Michael Fullan (Canada), Professor Howard Gardner (US), Professor Yvonne Hellman (The Netherlands), Professor Kristin Helstad (Norway), Jean Hendrickson (US), Professor Rose Hipkins (New Zealand), Professor Cornelia Hoogland (Canada), Mme. Chantal Kaufmann (Belgium), Professor Dominique Lafontaine (Belgium), Professor Hugh Lauder (UK), Professor Ben Levin (Canada), Professor Barry McGaw (Australia), Professor R. Natarajan (India), Dr. Denise Pope (US), Sridhar Rajagopalan (India), Dr. Diane Ravitch (US), Sir Ken Robinson (UK), Professor Pasi Sahlberg (Finland), Andreas Schleicher (PISA, OECD), Dr. Anthony Seldon (UK), Dr. David Shaffer (US), Dr. Kirsten Sivesind (Norway), Chancellor Stephen Spahn (US), Yves Theze (Lycee Francais US), Professor Charles Ungerleider (Canada), Professor Tony Wagner (US), Professor Dylan Wiliam (UK), Dr. Mark Wormald (UK), Professor Theo Wubbels (The Netherlands), Professor Michael Young (UK), and Professor Minxuan Zhang (China) as they explore the big picture education questions that all nations face today.
The Global Search for Education Community Page
C. M. Rubin is the author of two widely read online series for which she received a 2011 Upton Sinclair award, “The Global Search for Education” and “How Will We Read?”. She is also the author of three bestselling books, including The Real Alice in Wonderland.
The Global Search for Education
“The way to improve the quality of teaching is through teamwork in the schools, and then surround it with better teacher pre-service, better attraction of the profession, and better professional development.” – Michael Fullan
Change Leader
By C. M. Rubin with Harry Rubin and Michael Freeborn
Michael Fullan has been working to identify the right drivers for whole system education reform. His paper, “Choosing the Wrong Drivers for Whole System Reform,” has stimulated considerable interest from educators around the world (including the US) to understand the policies and strategies that can help get education into successful system reform, i.e. real solutions to closing the achievement gap and improving learning so that students learn better than they did before.
Michael Fullan is Professor Emeritus at the Ontario Institute for Studies in Education at the University of Toronto, and is Special Adviser on Education to Dalton McGuinty, the Premier of Ontario. Fullan served as dean of the faculty of education at the University of Toronto from 1988 to 2003. He is currently working as adviser and consultant on several major education reform initiatives around the world. His work is based on how large-scale reform can be successfully accomplished. He has written several best sellers on leadership and change. His latest book is Change Leader: Learning to Do What Matters Most.
What kind of education system will permit a country to have the people skills needed to compete globally?
We did a qualitative study called “The Slow Road to Higher Order Skills” to take a look at what we call the 21st century skills. The skills that are normally listed, like creativity, communication, collaboration, problem solving, reasoning and digital literacy, are not well operationalized. Even though there has been a big project from Cisco/Intel/Microsoft to do that, the progress has been very slow. In Ontario, we want to start deeply with literacy and numeracy. We do not want to be narrow in our focus but we also do not want to get into the vagaries of the 21st century skills that people talk about but do not operationalize. In short, no one seems to know what “there” looks like when it comes to higher order skills, and correspondingly, no one knows how to get there.
What are your views on standardized testing?
The worst thing a system can do is load up on standards and assessments in a way that overwhelms schools. This is wrong driver number one. Instead, we have to focus on instruction and learning (personalized to each student) as the centerpiece, and then link to standards and assessments. The driver here has to be assessment-instruction up close with the student and the teacher. In my paper, “Choosing the Wrong Drivers for Whole System Reform,” I identified how some systems are mishandling accountability.
[Editor’s note: To briefly summarize Fullan’s paper, the four wrong drivers are the focus on accountability (versus intrinsic motivation and capacity building), individual quality (versus group quality), technology (versus instruction), fragmented (versus systemic) solutions.]
Testing is important in what I am going to call the accountability strategy, but the push on standardized testing can become too narrow and it becomes a mindset that says we have to load up on assessment and also identify with world class standards (such as PISA) in terms of assessment. Almost all of the skills that I consider the high order skills are measurable if you want to measure them. Politicians make assessments based on testing that is narrower than it should be. The PISA test is a great example of how we can break out of that mold. On top of this, we have been working on the “black box” of implementation for which you not only need better assessments, but you also need innovative instruction in relation to those assessments. Once again, the core is assessment-instruction personalized to each learner.
We seem to have become assessment obsessed in the US since our poor results in the last PISA Test.
The greater urgency the US places on competing internationally, the more that becomes an obsession in the wrong direction. The US school systems have been losing ground since 1980 with growing gaps between high and low performers, and poor rankings internationally. The US needs to take PISA benchmarks seriously, they need to get behind the numbers and realize that the top performers got there by building the collective capacity of teachers in the country – all the teachers.
“With Sir Ken Robinson, we want to map out the curriculum that includes the arts as well as literacy and math.” – Michael Fullan
What can be done to better address the emotional well-being of some kids today given the rise in competition and the pressure to achieve?
We have too many tests, so one way to reduce stress is to have fewer tests. I agree we have to reduce the stress on kids. Enabling them to have more success would be a great stress reducer. So, I would rather ask first what goals we are striving for. Let’s build those goals into the learning experience. And those goals have to include the well-being of our kids.
I think of the problem as a three legged stool. Let’s call the three legs: standards, assessment, and instruction. I want to go beyond the word curriculum and focus also on instruction. We’ve got standards. Even though they’ve not improved enough, there is a foot in the door around higher level skills, which should include well being. Our solution is to strengthen the two way street between instruction and assessment. Assessment should be a strategy teachers use to personalize the curriculum for kids and to improve instruction. Dylan Wiliam has published a book called Embedded Formative Assessment (Solution Tree), and it’s all about teachers and students engaged in the two way street between instruction and assessment of how they are doing. The answer for me is to zero in on instruction and assessment. In addition, we are beginning to work with Sir Ken Robinson to ensure curriculum is broadened to include the arts. Students’ well-being will be greatly served by tapping into the intrinsic motivation of a range of kids. (Editor’s Note: see Global Search for Education, C. M. Rubin’s interviews with Sir Ken Robinson and with Dylan Wiliam.)
What is the nature of the respect for teachers in countries that are doing well in education?
When you look at Finland, Singapore, South Korea and Hong Kong, all of which have high quality teachers, you will see that it’s not just that they have good teachers, but also because they have improved the whole profession. It’s a combination of incentivizing teachers and improving working conditions. Teacher’s salaries have been going up in the US, so it’s not just about teachers’ salaries. It is more about the respect for teachers, the quality of their preparation, the working conditions, and enabling teachers to work together. It’s a big task for the US because the US is starting so far behind.
What the US is counting on is the wrong driver on teacher appraisal. We think the way to improve the quality of teaching is through teamwork in the schools, and then surround it with better teacher pre-service, better attraction of the profession, and better professional development. Those surround things are enablers rather than causes, and the core cause is to improve the profession itself. You have to improve the entire teaching profession, not just reward the top 20% and punish the bottom 20%. You have to improve the daily work of all teachers, which is what we are doing in Ontario.
Does Canada’s definition of educational excellence take into account the quality of life of individuals and of a society’s artistic and cultural achievements?
No, not yet. I have been an advisor to the Premier of Ontario since 2003. We are in our 8th year now and we have spent a lot of time getting the house in order, so to speak. I would say that what we have done is get to the point where our next phase is to go for the whole well-being of the child. We have the stage set to do that. Five years ago, OECD UNESCO did a report on child well-being in rich countries. This study assessed the well-being of students in about 20 countries. It showed Canada well down. A policy objective has to be the well-being of students. We are looking forward to working with Sir Ken Robinson from the UK who, as you know, has advocated for the arts in education for over a decade. We need to integrate some of Ken’s thinking into our ongoing goals. Specifically, what we are now working on is to integrate technology, pedagogy, and change knowledge to accelerate personalized learning. We need learning that is deeply engaging for students, precise (i.e. it has to be specific and concrete), high yield (big return for the effort) and higher order. With Sir Ken Robinson, we want to map out the curriculum that includes the arts as well as literacy and math.
Professor Michael Fullan and C. M. Rubin
(Photos courtesy of the Dwight School and Michael Fullan)
In The Global Search for Education, join C. M. Rubin and globally renowned thought leaders including Sir Michael Barber (UK), Dr. Leon Botstein (US), Dr. Linda Darling-Hammond (US), Dr. Madhav Chavan (India), Professor Michael Fullan (Canada), Professor Howard Gardner (US), Professor Yvonne Hellman (The Netherlands), Professor Kristin Helstad (Norway), Professor Rose Hipkins (New Zealand), Professor Cornelia Hoogland (Canada), Mme. Chantal Kaufmann (Belgium), Professor Dominique Lafontaine (Belgium), Professor Hugh Lauder (UK), Professor Ben Levin (Canada), Professor Barry McGaw (Australia), Professor R. Natarajan (India), Sridhar Rajagopalan (India), Sir Ken Robinson (UK), Professor Pasi Sahlberg (Finland), Andreas Schleicher (PISA, OECD), Dr. Anthony Seldon, Dr. David Shaffer (US), Dr. Kirsten Sivesind (Norway), Chancellor Stephen Spahn (US), Yves Theze (Lycee Francais US), Professor Charles Ungerleider (Canada), Professor Tony Wagner (US), Professor Dylan Wiliam (UK), Professor Theo Wubbels (The Netherlands), Professor Michael Young (UK), and Professor Minxuan Zhang (China) as they explore the big picture education questions that all nations face today.
The Global Search for Education
C.M. Rubin has more than two decades of professional experience in development, marketing, and art direction for a diverse range of media businesses. She is also the author of three bestselling books, including The Real Alice In Wonderland.
Follow C. M. Rubin on Twitter: www.twitter.com/@cmrubinworld
